Bava Kamma 177

Chapter 177

א והרי היא תחתיו ומשמשתו ונמצאו זוממין אין אומרים ישלמו כל כתובתה אלא טובת הנאת כתובתה איזהו טובת הנאת כתובתה אומדין כמה אדם רוצה ליתן בכתובה של זו שאם נתארמלה או נתגרשה ואם מתה יירשנה בעלה
1 while the woman in question was still with him<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., that particular person who was her husband, as he had never divorced her. ');"><sup>1</sup></span>
ב ואי סלקא דעתך ליתא לתקנת אושא אמאי יירשנה בעלה תזבין כתובתה לגמרי
2 and in fact looking after him, and the witnesses were subsequently proved <i>zomemim</i>, it would not be right to say that they should pay [the woman]<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In retaliation, as required in Deut. XIX, 19. ');"><sup>2</sup></span>
ג אמר אביי אם אמרו בנכסי מלוג יאמרו בנכסי צאן ברזל
3 the whole amount of her <i>kethubah</i>, [as she did not lose anything] but the satisfaction of the benefit of [being provided with] her <i>kethubah</i>.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since it was but a conditional liability, i.e., becoming mature either through her being divorced or through her remaining a widow. ');"><sup>3</sup></span>
ד אמר אביי טובת הנאה הואיל ואתא לידן נימא בה מילתא טובת הנאה לאשה הויא דאי ס"ד לבעל הויא לימרו לה עדים מאי אפסדינך אי הות מזבנת לה לטובת הנאה בעל הוה שקיל מינך אמר רב שלמן משום דאיכא רווח ביתא
4 How could [the value of] the satisfaction of the benefit of her <i>kethubah</i> be arrived at?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since it was but a conditional liability, i.e., becoming mature either through her being divorced or through her remaining a widow. ');"><sup>3</sup></span>
ה אמר רבא הלכתא טובת הנאה לאשה ואין הבעל אוכל פירות מאי טעמא פירא תקינו ליה רבנן פירא דפירא לא תקינו ליה רבנן
5 An estimate will have to be made of how much a man would be prepared to pay as purchase money for the <i>kethubah</i> of this [particular woman] which can mature only after she is left a widow or divorced, since, were she [previously] to die her husband would inherit her.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And there would then be no occasion for the payment of the kethubah (cf. Mak. 3a). ');"><sup>4</sup></span>
ו כי אתא רב פפא ורב הונא בריה דרב יהושע מבי רב אמרי תנינא לתקנת אושא העבד והאשה פגיעתן רעה החובל בהן חייב והם שחבלו באחרים פטורין ואי ס"ד ליתא לתקנת אושא תזבין נכסי מלוג ותתן ליה
6 Now, if you assume that this enactment of Usha is of no avail, why is it certain that her husband would inherit her? Why should she be unable to sell her <i>kethubah</i> outright?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' If the husband would have no right to recover the possessions thus alienated. Why then should the witnesses not pay the woman the full amount of the kethubah? ');"><sup>5</sup></span>
ז ולטעמיך נהי נמי דאיתיה לתקנת אושא ולא מצי מזבנה לגמרי תזבין לנכסי מלוג בטובת הנאה ותתן ליה אלא דלית לה ה"נ דלית לה
7 Abaye said: If all this could be said<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' By R. Jeremiah against Rab Judah, thus ignoring the enactment of Usha. ');"><sup>6</sup></span>
ח ותזבין כתובתה בטובת הנאה ותתן ליה הא מני רבי מאיר היא דאמר אסור לו לאדם שישהא את אשתו אפילו שעה אחת בלא כתובה
8 regarding <i>melog</i> possessions,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In which the husband had only the right of usufruct while the substance belonged to the wife; v. Glos. ');"><sup>7</sup></span>
ט וטעמא מאי כדי שלא תהא קלה בעיניו להוציאה הכא לא מגרש לה דאי מגרש לה אתו הנך דזבני גבו לה לכתובתה מיניה
9 can it also be said<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' [That the woman should be able to sell outright.] ');"><sup>8</sup></span>
י אלא טובת הנאה מילי נינהו ומילי לא משתעבדי
10 regarding the possessions [placed in the husband's hands<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As absolutely his own property. ');"><sup>9</sup></span>
יא אלמה לא מילי דמזדבני בדינרי נינהו אלא משום דשמואל דאמר שמואל המוכר שטר חוב לחבירו וחזר ומחלו מחול ואפי' יורש מוחל
11 and secured<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' By him on his general estate to pay her for them her Kethubah in case she would become a widow or divorced. ');"><sup>10</sup></span>
יב אמרי זבוני זבין ותתן ליה ואי מחלה ליה לגבי בעל תמחלה
12 as if they were] 'iron flocks'?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Zon barzel. I.e., 'flocks' sold on credit and the payment made secure as 'iron', v. B.B. (Sonc. ed.) p. 206, n. 3. ');"><sup>11</sup></span>
יג אמרי כל לגבי בעל ודאי מחלה ליה ואפסדיניה לההוא זבינא בידים לא אפסדינהו
13 Abaye further said: Since the subject of the [mere] satisfaction of a benefit has been raised, let us say something on it. The [purchase money of this] satisfaction of the benefit would belong solely to the woman. For if you assume that it should be subject to [the rights of] the husband, why could the witnesses not argue against her: 'What loss did we cause you, for should you even have sold the satisfaction of the benefit, the husband would have taken away [the purchase money] from you'? — R. Shalman, however, said: Because [even then] there would have been ample domestic provision.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As it is also for her benefit that the income of her husband increases. ');"><sup>12</sup></span>
יד וכי תימא זבינא ניהליה לההוא דחבלה ביה בטובת הנאה
14 Raba stated: 'The law is that the purchase money for the satisfaction of the benefit belongs solely to the woman, and the husband will have no right to enjoy any profit [that may result from it], the reason being that it was only profits that the Rabbis assigned to him,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Out of the substance belonging to her. Cf. Keth. 47b and 79b. ');"><sup>13</sup></span> whereas profits out of profits<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Such as here in the case of the purchase money. ');"><sup>14</sup></span> were not assigned to him by the Rabbis. When R. Papa and R. Huna the son of R. Joshua came from the College they said: We have learnt to the same effect as the enactment of Usha [in the following Mishnah]: A SLAVE AND A WOMAN ARE AWKWARD TO DEAL WITH, AS HE WHO INJURES THEM IS LIABLE [TO PAY], WHEREAS IF THEY HAVE INJURED OTHERS THEY ARE EXEMPT.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. supra p. 502, n. 1. ');"><sup>15</sup></span> Now, if you assume that the enactment of Usha is not effective why should she not sell her <i>melog</i><span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. Glos. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> property and with the purchase money pay the compensation? — But even according to your reasoning, granted that the enactment of Usha is effective, in which case she would be powerless to alienate altogether her <i>melog</i> possessions, yet let her sell the <i>melog</i> estate for what the satisfaction of the benefit would fetch<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., that the purchaser should stand in her place and become entitled to it in case she should become a widow or divorced. ');"><sup>17</sup></span> and with his purchase money pay the compensation? It must therefore Surely be said that the ruling applies where she had no <i>melog</i> property; so also [according to the other view] the ruling would apply only where she possessed no <i>melog</i> property. But why should she not sell her <i>kethubah</i> for as much as the satisfaction of the benefit will fetch<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., that the purchaser should stand in her place and become entitled to it in case she should become a widow or divorced. ');"><sup>17</sup></span> and thus pay compensation? — The ruling is based on the view of R. Meir, who said that it is prohibited for any man to keep his wife without a <i>kethubah</i> even for one hour.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Keth. 57a. ');"><sup>18</sup></span> But what is the reason of this? So that it should not be an easy matter in his eyes to divorce her. In this case too he will surely not divorce her, for if he were to divorce her those who purchased the <i>kethubah</i> would certainly come and collect the amount of the <i>kethubah</i> from him. [Why then should she not be compelled by law to sell her <i>kethubah</i> and pay her creditors?] — We must therefore say that the satisfaction of such a benefit is a value of an abstract nature<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'words', 'an order for payment'. ');"><sup>19</sup></span> and abstract values are not considered mortgaged [for the payment of liabilities]. But why not? Could these abstract values not be sold for actual <i>denarii</i>? — We must therefore [say that it would not be practical to compel her to sell her <i>kethubah</i>] on account of the statement of Samuel. For Samuel said:<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' B.M. 20a; B.B. 147b. ');"><sup>20</sup></span> Where a creditor assigns a liability on a bill to another and subsequently releases the debtor from payment, the debt is considered cancelled. Moreover, the creditor's heir may cancel the liability.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' It would therefore not be practical to compel her to sell her kethubah, for she might subsequently release the husband from the liability of the kethubah. ');"><sup>21</sup></span> I would, however, ask: Why should she not be compelled to sell it and pay with the proceeds the compensation, though if she should subsequently release her husband from the obligation the release would be legally valid? — It may be replied that since it is quite certain that where there is an obligation on the husband the wife will release him, it would not be right to make a sale which will straight away be nullified. Should you say, why should she not assign her <i>kethubah</i> to the person whom she injured, thus letting him have the satisfaction of the benefit,